Additional Halyards

[Wild Thing]

Wildthing will likely be participating in many lake Ontario offshore events this coming season. It would be beneficial to have a few extra halyards in order to perform headsail or spinnaker changes while underway. I was thinking of using the two exixisting halyards as head sail internal halyards and devising a crane to accomodate two new external spinnaker halyards.

Has anyone done anything like this? Is this a reasonnable approach; i.e. any concern with the mast construction, any concnern with additional weight aloft?

Any thoughts are welcome.

Thanks!

[darkstar32170]

I'm surprised that there seems to be so much variation in the masthead cranes of E32-2. "Dark Star" is set up with one centerline halyard and two wing halyards. I believe "Motorboat" is set up for two jib halyards and two spinnaker halyards.

I would be surprised if you don't have one of these setups. Are you sure that you don't have an empty space for an additional halyard?

[Pterobyte]

Mine has two wings. They double duty as spin and genoa. Being used to the old IOR boats with lots of haylards, this setup surprised me. The first item on my list for upgrades to the boat was one more halyard. But other things took precedent.

I am glad I waited because for the buoy races they work just fine. On distance races we just have to be sure we have the halyards matched to the foil slot we are using at the time and head sail changes work great on the fly as well. What i need are double foot blocks, I only have single shiv turning blocks.

I am gong to give my boat another season before i decide on the added halyard.

The quickest way to do the extra halyard is to put a bail on the mast head with a block and run the line external.
kenyon

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[Wild Thing]

I have the same setup as Pterobyte, only 2 wing halyards... I still have what I belive to be the original mast-mounted footblocks; I would probably need to consider my options with those, as there isn't eneough space with the current mast base arrangment to accomodate additional footblocks.

Sounds like there would be no issue accomodating the extra halyards though sinec some baots are alredy configured that way.

Thanks!

[darkstar32170]

I think the three halyard setup works really well. Its one less line to worry about and less weight aloft. We always start with the jib on the center halyard (I know who wouldn't) with the sail in the starboard groove and automatically plan on setting the spinnaker from the starboard wing halyard so that the port wing halyard and groove are available for any jib change. This also means that on a port rounded weather mark both halyards are on the starboard cabintop winch so weight is still on the high side throughout the rounding.

The double footblocks are a necessity and unfortunately pretty expensive. With the new deck on "Dark Star" I would have liked to replace all the hardware with new and maybe this spring there will be at least some new deck hardware but the footblocks were not going to be a part of that. My foot blocks were a mess with a least one sheave seized and bearing missing out of a couple of the others. I couldn't identify what brand they were. They even may have been custom built. Luckily I was able to find Harken sheaves that were close to the original size and by adding a washer to the spacers between the plates accommodate their the slightly wider sheave. As you can see from the photo they are pretty simple with 3 galvanized steel plates w/ nylon spacers and stainless steel bolts. There is a cam "jammer" but I've never used it. I'll give you the dimensions if you want to try making your own.

[darkstar32170]

Guy: The footblocks that Pterobyte referred to are the blocks between your genoa leads and your primary winches through which the genoa sheets are lead. You need double footblocks to make headsail changes properly.

Are you sure that there isn't a space in your masthead for a centerline halyard?

[darkstar32170]

"MY BAD!!!" Its been too long since I've been on my own boat. I only have two foresail halyards too - and I think "Motorboat" has a three halyard setup.

I was looking for a good photo of my mast base turning blocks and started counting lines. The blocks are actually mounted on the mast and not on the deck like many boats. The main halyard and starboard halyard are on one side and the port halyard and spin pole topping lift are on the other side. Here is the best photo I have of my mast base. It doesn't show the whole thing but you'll get the idea.

It isn't a great arrangement because there's no space left for any sort of mast boot to keep water from getting below.

The two foresail halyard setup works well and in the 12 years of owning the boat I've never wished for more.

[Pterobyte]

Strictly my option and not based on any true engineering data but I think the mast base blocks are on the mast because when they first starting putting them on the deck a lot of decks got pulled up. Since then I think the re-enforcement of the cabin tops allowed for the blocks to be put on the cabin top. This was early 80's when the winches started to come off the mast proper and lead aft.

If you put these blocks on the deck, like modern boats, you will have to add some cabin top hold down system. Mine has a collar added inside around the mast hole and a turn buckle holding the deck down to the mast. This is common on newer boats and was also on the '42. that being said, my blocks are also attached to the mast. The hold down system on my boat lends tremendous stiffness to the boat over all.

Me in the OLD days, note winches on mast on this Ericson 39'. This is when bowmen were 'REALY' busy.,

[Motorboat!!]

Yeah, we have 3 halyards: The center halyard is the primary jib (you could probably lift the boat with it), and we have 2 wings, which are crossed inside the mast, so the port wing halyard (primary spin halyard) comes out on the starboard side of the mast allowing the mast person to hoist from the high side. I can't imagine using 4 halyards on a 32' boat. If we ever need to do headsail changes, we just use the spare wing for both genoa and spinnakers.

[Wild Thing]

Thanks for the valuable info...

Definitely only two halyards... unless I'm missing something!

I have the same blocks also; I now understand why they are mounted to the mast... and what would be involved in replacing them with modern lightweight blocks.

Unfortunately, I'm still confused over the footblock issue; are you referring to the deck organizers? WildThing has recent Spinlock organizers and I could easily stack another unit on the top the 2-up on starboard (main and jib halyards) or the 3-up on port (spin halyard, topping lift and downhaul, which I want to replace with a double-ended unit this year)

[darkstar32170]

No, these are footblocks (see photo). This photo is before I did any of my recently completed deck repair and refinishing.

I notice that your mast base turning blocks are mounted higher that mine so you can get a proper mast boot over the opening. I have about 1/2" between the top of the collar and the underside of the blocks. Pterobyte you are right about the deck mounted mast base blocks pulling up on the deck. I've seen lightly built sportboats where tensioning a halyard changed the shape of the midsection of the boat - NOT GOOD.

I remember the days of mast mounted winches and winch clusters around the mast base. One of the first boats on which I sailed had a cluster of 7 winches on the deck around the mast; 4 foresail halyards, a main halyard, topping lift, and cunningham. This was on a 33 foot boat (Morgan 33T, an IOR 3/4 tonner). The foredeck crew (me) on a spinnaker takedown uncleated the spin halyard and took the tail with him to the bow where he tripped the shackle at the pole then flipped the halyard off the winch. We sailed with a crew of 6 without anyone assigned as mastman. Foredeck crew did it all.

[Motorboat!!]

Agreed about the blocks on the mast. In general, I think you want to minimize the vertical loads on the deck. I was amazed by how much movement I had in my deck. I could just push on it and get almost 3/4" of play in it. I ended up installing a large pad eye on either side of the mast and running 2 pieces of Amsteel from there to the keel to help tie the deck down.

[Pterobyte]

Once you ensure the deck is secure you use these with proper backing. There is a lot of upward, as opposed to shear, load on these so be sure the backing plates are substantial.

http://www.harkenstore.com/uniface.urd/scpdinw1.showProd?B4RPMEB9Y97TYS

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